Kinetic

created : 10 months ago| | live deployment: 84

created : 10 months ago | live deployment: 84

Kinetic

by: Dravyaniti Consulting

Volatility IVSkew VerticalSpreads Momentum TrendFollowing ShortVol Directional Bullish Bearish Intraday

48 ratings

Strategy description

Keep Calm.
Invest in Kinetic.

(Notes: Due to surge in margin requirements from time to time, Recommended minimum capital is 4 lacs. Revised historical annualised return is 52% and max historical DD is 8%)

FAQ Summary:

Mix of multiple strategies

Intraday + Positional

100% Mechanical

Options Writing + Options Buying

Variable Position Sizing

Kinetic is built on Weekly Index Options and trades on Bank Nifty weeklies at the moment. The same strategy which we offer to large institutions and proprietary desks are now available for individuals.

Kinetic's Reward to Risk Ratio is greater than 3:1. The system has been piloted in live market for 6 months.

The strategy is a mixture of multiple strategies which are complementary to each other. This increases our chances of success.

Some of the unique features of the system are:

a) In-built Regime switch between Non-Trending and Trending Market. Adapts to current market conditions.

b) Dynamic (Volatility - based) Position Sizing

c) Always hedged positions allow for lesser volatility of returns and lower draw-downs. Intraday positions are also hedged. .

d) Consistent Performer - 90% Months are positive (i.e. 43 out of 48 months in Back-testing period)

e) When Non-Trending Mode is on, 4-legged spread positions will be created. When Trending Mode is on, we will be long call or long put.

f) Apart from generating absolute returns, may be used to hedge existing MF or Equity Investments

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Exchanges

NFO

Capital Required

₹ 400,000

Monthly Fee

Free + 18.00 %

Subscribers

View all

Sunil Sharma

Ramkrishna

Akash Bachhawat

gurjeev ANAND

Nihar

Statistics

Raunaq Bhatia 4 days ago

how to pay the profit share

Pankaj Natani 5 days ago

how do i pay your profit share ?

Mohammad Anwar 6 days ago

Hi team, Please let me know the maximum investment we can be deploy in Kinetic strategy Please also confirm the day and time to deploy your strategy

Abhishek Finserv Private Limited 2 weeks ago

why kinetic is not performing good from the last three weeks, and the profit and loss amount in tradetron is also not correct. I dont know how trade tron update profit and loss of the strategy.

Dravyaniti Consulting 2 weeks ago

hi, In past we have seen periods upto 12 weeks approx. where strategy has undergone drawdowns. we are still well within historical drawdowns and we are tracking this. as regards tradetron PnL kindly check with Tradetron support team as to your query regarding PnL and they should be able to help you

Vikram Dudani 2 weeks ago

Hi I see a lot of Long Calls and Puts are far OTM which in most of the brokers, atleast 2 of them which I use would get rejected quite often, do you think it would be advisable to do without them in case they do not trade (Ofcourse if adequate Margin is available). I used to do Iron Condors but shifted to Strangles because of this and did not find any significant difference. Your views please

Vikram Dudani 2 weeks ago

Also where can we tlak to you in case of small queries/issues, Any telegram/WA group for it ?

Dravyaniti Consulting 2 weeks ago

Hi Vikram, some brokers do facilitate this more easily compared to other brokers. however, even with brokers where we have seen issues occur, there is a particular sequence in which if orders are fired, the trade goes through more often than not. worst case, after few minutes, the orders are fired again The real deal for doing Iron Condors is to hedge against "Tail Risk" or "Black Swan" events. What has never happened in markets before can happen, hence we believe it is better to be hedged and approach the markets keeping in view the first goal of protecting principal. You can reach us on 77100 12476

Rohan Soni 4 weeks ago

Is it possible in any way to deploy around Rs. 2 Lakhs?

Dravyaniti Consulting 3 weeks ago

No Rohan, not recommended to run Kinetic below the capital requirement stated, We are working on other product which may be deployed around 2 lakhs, and when it's ready we will launch on Tradetron

Jaideep Bhattacharjee 1 month ago

The 31100CE sell is getting rejected by my broker due to low liquidity. Please advise what should be done. Regards.

Dravyaniti Consulting 1 month ago

There was a problem at some broker end yesterday, we believe it showed positions were made zero, and that's the best thing to do in such cases

Vivekanand 1 month ago

Typically how many trades this strategy takes in a day? Also like entry trigger, will the strategy give SL trigger or Exit triggers also? Or SL orders are placed by the strategy while placing the entry order?

Dravyaniti Consulting 1 month ago

Vivekanand, thanks for raising these questions. Every sell signal is 4 legged. on average, 8-10 trades a day are taken. SL and exits will be given by strategy in real-time and not while placing the order

Hariprasad Pamuri 1 month ago

Very nice

Dravyaniti Consulting 1 month ago

Thank you Lokeshwari! Your encouragement means a lot to us

Akshay K 1 month ago

Hi I have a same question, If I deploy it from monday is that okay or it will get partially executed .......and my second query is there any 2 way channel available in case of any major problem? thanks

Dravyaniti Consulting 1 month ago

hi, you can deploy from Monday Akshay. for any queries you can connect with Tradetron helpdesk

bala subra 1 month ago

Hi team , if i subscribe how will my trade execute , will it wait for the new trade to execute or it will execute in the middle of an on going trade statergy .

Dravyaniti Consulting 1 month ago

hi Bala, it will always take a new trade only

Dravyaniti Consulting 1 month ago

and since there are no open trades, you can deploy and it will take every trade from now on

Balaji Prabhakaran 1 month ago

I deployed this strategy today.. not seeing any trades yet.. just wanted to check if there is an issue with my deployment OR if the strategy didn't trigger any trades yet. thank you!

Dravyaniti Consulting 1 month ago

on Friday's, KINETIC energy gets converted into Potential energy Balaji. It means, we are at rest. From Monday, you may see the energy (Trades) flowing through :)

Satya S 1 month ago

It looks like a solid strategy and was in +zone from day 1 on live deployment. Will know only after a month about the net return after all costs.

Dravyaniti Consulting 1 month ago

thanks for your comments, yes please do track that. also, give the strategy atleast 6-9 months to play out / show it's potential

CK 1 month ago

Hi, I hv subscribed the kinetic strategy for paper trading from 1 week. Looks good on paper but still unable to figure out the actual returns after all expenses like tradetron charges, your profit share, api charges, brokerage ect. If you can give me details would me much appreciated. Also how I can multiple the trades? Let's say with 20L?

Dravyaniti Consulting 1 month ago

hi CK. actual returns will definitely reduce than what paper shows, and it will be affected by quality of execution on your broker's end. also it will have some variances based on real-time issues such as connectivity/downtime which can come at any of the part of the ecosystem - exchange/broker/our platform however, clients have net net been growing their wealth meaningfully using this strategy, so we suggest you stay put :) to use a capital of 20L, you may have to choose a 5x multiplier (To base capital of 4 lac)

mukesh marhia 1 month ago

I am watching it since last few days. Found interesting. I want to know about margin requirement of 4lac.Is this margin going to increase further once leverage will be zero or there will be no increase as it is full nrml margin? One more thing i want to know about transactions how many transactions normally taking place per week? This will help me to know about my cost of brokerage.

Dravyaniti Consulting 1 month ago

thanks for your interest in KINETIC, Mukesh a) Margin requirement is not expected to go up for us as we are not utilising any additional intraday margins b) There may be between 40 to 60 trades in a week

Abhishek Gupta 1 month ago

Hi Team, I just subscribed to this strategy for live deployment and I am wondering how can I see if the setup is deployed correctly. I am asking this because the strategy is live in Tradetron but didn't trigger any trade until now so I am not sure if I need to anything else to make it active. Thanks in advance for your response.

Dravyaniti Consulting 1 month ago

kindly check with Tradetron helpdesk Abhishek and they will guide you

yadu yadav 1 month ago

hey are you showing profits after taxes, exchange charges or before charges?

Dravyaniti Consulting 1 month ago

hi, in the equity curve backtest shown, that is after charges in the equity curve generated in Live, it is auto-generated and that is before charges, charges = brokerage + slippages + regulatory costs (exchange) income tax and our software fees are not covered in charges

Sk 1 month ago

For April month live deployment , which date is right for deployment.

Dravyaniti Consulting 1 month ago

Sadhana, if you see historical returns of this strategy, along with the live returns curve, it shows very less instances of drawdown (i.e. losing phases). also apart from one or two phases, the drawdowns are mild. so we suggest you go ahead and deploy it, only thing to keep in mind is that the amount of max drawdown this is shown is something you can afford to risk. then you may tend to stick to the system

Aarohi S 2 months ago

Made my day today... Nice profit this week. Awesome strategy...

Dravyaniti Consulting 2 months ago

We are glad to hear this :) thanks for subscribing

subhashis bag 2 months ago

becareful about your hard earned money. do not deploy it live with money. check wihtout money for 1 month , price and time and execution. then deploy. money making is not easy just by selling ATM straddle with hedge , otherwise everybody will earn

Dravyaniti Consulting 2 months ago

dear Subhashis, we agree that just by selling ATM straddle with hedge may not be the best way to trade volatility therefore, there are multiple rules that go into our system, including position sizing based on volatility and different risk parameters. we would therefore suggest that you observe in live for a while and see we do understand that you faced hiccups with your initial experience, which is mostly due to exchange/broker end glitch, over which we have no control. we do hope that after satisying yourself over the paper trade results, you may consider deploying the algo again

subhashis bag 2 months ago

sorry to say. i m not satisfied with your clarification. in tradetron u r showung profit but on actual there is loss in 3 weeks(last)

Dravyaniti Consulting 1 month ago

in tradetron it auto generates equity curve. and different live accounts may have differences due to how clients manage their overall margin, issues at broker's end, etc.

Vaishali Medankar 2 months ago

Please make a telegram group for all subscribers and post daily profit & loss on that group

Dravyaniti Consulting 2 months ago

We are working on this, including some automation, In the interim, we are getting feedback from most users that execution is now smooth

Pravin Rangdal 2 months ago

Can you please share daywise P&L for last 6 months? Any updates of starting of communication channel?

Dravyaniti Consulting 2 months ago

Yes group will be formed by this weekend. Also we will be uploading a Daily PnL statement and share google Drive link

Pravin Rangdal 2 months ago

Thanks for reply. I will wait your reply.

Prem Pai 2 months ago

Tried for a month , didn't work for me! PNL for Feb = 520 ( before expenses), not sure how your results are showing 4k profit It looked promising in the first 10 days and I was about to go 10X! Thankfully I didn't! Tradetron fees = 1000 ZErodha fees = 2000 Brokerage+taxes = plus plus Good bye Tradetron,

Dravyaniti Consulting 2 months ago

we are sorry to see you go. unfortunately last week we have seen a technical glitch which impacted lots of systematic traders including us. algorithmic trading systems are not free from risks such as market/technology and our aim is to minimise these risks, and aim to generate return adjusting for these. if you decide to expand your horizon for longer than a month i.e. minimum 9-12 months, maybe this is for you, and you may want to re-look thanks

Prem Pai 2 months ago

Thanks for your prompt response, I have decided to stay for now! :) On a side note, would you be aware of any issues if I use 5paisa broker instead of Zerodha? With 5P I won't have to worry about logging in daily.

Dravyaniti Consulting 2 months ago

sorry missed this message totally. so in 5P we are seeing users are facing some execution challenges from time to time, you may want to consider the trade-off

Ashoke Kumar Das 2 months ago

Poor client support. So many times i asked for the true/live auto P&L spreadsheet. Others are providing all details to gain trust. This bot may be fantastic but can’t go live due to poor support.

Dravyaniti Consulting 2 months ago

we have sent details ashoke, can you confirm if received. if not, please msg on 77100 12476 and will revert to you thank you

Poonam Pradhan 2 months ago

Started Live Deployment from 15-Feb-2020 So far only 9 trading Days and Total Loss around 29K (+ charges) Poor support (rather no support) or advise on the day of NSE Glitch. I posted a Generic Query 3 days back, No reply so far. No Telegram Channel where we can get instructions in case of any issues. When I joined, Live deployments were 91, Now 57. I will still give it one more week.

Poonam Pradhan 2 months ago

Not able to write comment with Line Breaks so writing as separate comments below:

Poonam Pradhan 2 months ago

— Started Live Deployment from 15-Feb-2020 . So far only 9 trading Days and Total Loss around 29K (+ charges)

Poonam Pradhan 2 months ago

— Poor support (rather no support) or advise on the day of NSE Glitch.

Poonam Pradhan 2 months ago

— I posted a Generic Query 3 days back, No reply so far.

Poonam Pradhan 2 months ago

— No Telegram Channel where we can get instructions in case of any issues.

Poonam Pradhan 2 months ago

— When I joined, Live deployments were 91, Now 57. I will still give it one more week.

Dravyaniti Consulting 2 months ago

Dear Poonam We understand that there have been some problems and communication has not reached you, we tried on best effort basis to communicate to go on square off Since the glitch, we have done universal exit and squared off positions, this has been totally unprecedented for us also as algorithmic trading softwares are designed to run during market hours only Due to the large number of queries there have been one on one communication delays, and we totally understand that / apologise for it. We are working on strengthening this by a whatsapp / telegram channel Thanks for trying us out for another week,

Poonam Pradhan 2 months ago

Update: Initial Loss of 29 K already recovered. And I am in Profit now. Will keep reviewing it for atleast one more month with 1x Live Auto. Then will decide, if I should increase Capital.

MANISH WADHWANI 2 months ago

Didnt get message to square off position.

Dravyaniti Consulting 2 months ago

Dear Manish, There were some issues with the broadcast messaging as we are given to understand, we sent out two messages on the day of the glitch, however it seems they did not get transmitted. Due to the number of queries there have been delays in answering the one-on-one queries, thanks for keeping the faith and trust we are working on whatsapp/telegram channel and will revert

Nihar 2 months ago

Where and whom to contact, 77100 12476 SMS are not going through, called but just ringing.. how to get in touch in case of urgency. Thanks.

Nihar 2 months ago

Like many others, it is now high time that you dedicated Telegram channel so that you do not have to rely only on TT broadcasting.

Prasanta Modak 2 months ago

I have seen several strategy in tradetron. Buy yours is best. Can you provide total back test report to my mail id prasantakrmodak16@gmail.com?

Vinay Gouli 3 months ago

I think most of the profit is eaten by Transaction cost. @DravyanyiConsulting - Can you provide the returns details considering the transaction cost?

Dravyaniti Consulting 2 months ago

if paper trading is showing 2.15 lacs profit here, live may be approx 1.7 lacs after slippages and costs. The actual figures will depend on each one's own broker execution infra as well, but more or less this would be average. You may want to try yourself and see, Vinay.

Hardik Patel 3 months ago

Hello, Is it recommended/required to have an upgraded tradetron account which have continuous condition check?

Dravyaniti Consulting 3 months ago

Hi it is recommended but not mandatory

Utkal Desai 3 months ago

Hi, Zerodha requires daily updating of API key. what broker do you recommend for fully automating the strategy without any requirement of intervention?

Dravyaniti Consulting 3 months ago

we are broker neutral you may look at any of the others.

FM 3 months ago

I understand that the returns shown on the strategy page are based on paper trading. Could you give an idea about the approx returns so far in a real account. Returns after taxes and charges and profit sharing. I am considering investing, but would like an idea about the real returns over the last few months. I had asked this question a few months back. Didn't get a response. So leaving a low rating assuming that low ratings attract attention. Will be happy to change the rating if I get a response with the required data.

Dravyaniti Consulting 3 months ago

You did catch our attention ! We missed your message in the past about your request for post cost and slippage returns, kindly drop a message on 77100 12476 with your email id and we will revert to you

prakash 3 months ago

Can you explain the strategy ?

Dravyaniti Consulting 3 months ago

kindly send a message on 77100 12476 Prakash, we will revert to you.

M R N Rao 3 months ago

I can confidently recommend this strategy to all Newcomers. Just deploy and forget it, It takes care of your returns.

Dravyaniti Consulting 3 months ago

"Just deploy and forget it" says a lot about your own temperament Mr.Rao. Kudos Cheers Team Dravyaniti

Dishin Shrimanker 4 months ago

I have been using this strategy for 4 weeks now and must say mighty impressed. It has worked beautifully for me and the returns are outstanding - more than what is shown on the TT page (though I understand there will be bad days in the future :P . Additional aspect that I would like to highlight is that despite being a positional strategy, it is fully hedged overnight and the fact that you know your max loss means that you don't lose sleep over it. Kudos to the team and keep it up! :)

Dravyaniti Consulting 4 months ago

Hey Dishin, many thanks for the kind words - we appreciate the trust you have placed with us and believe Kinetic customers are one large family, so yes, peaceful sleep is something we value more than the money we make. We could ooze out a couple of percentage points more, but we don't think it's worth losing sleep over. So yes, always hedged (risk-defined) is our mantra. We aim to keep enhancing the Kinetic algo so that it keeps us delighted. Cheers- Team Dravyaniti

Ravi Uday 4 months ago

Great Job. This looks interesting. I have pledged liquid bees in Zerodha, how much extra cash in account is required to start with this algo?

Dravyaniti Consulting 4 months ago

Thank you for your kind words Ravi. 20% can be in cash, 80% in margin. if there are still any doubts, please reach out on our support no 77100 12476

Ravi Uday 4 months ago

Sometimes Zerodha will not allow to buy Deep OTM Puts/Calls, is this issue solved with Zerodha? Will this affect kinetic algo?

Swayam 4 months ago

What will be the margin requirement after September 2021?

Dravyaniti Consulting 4 months ago

It would not affect us as we are not using any additional intraday leverage

Satheesh Kumar 4 months ago

which is the best broker to deploy .i need choose between zerodha and alice blue

Dravyaniti Consulting 4 months ago

we have happy users from both zerodha and alice blue, so you can choose some people refer to as zerodha being more stable

Satheesh Kumar 4 months ago

do i need keep 4 lakh in account . it seems it not used that much i am in 1x only . please let me know

Dravyaniti Consulting 4 months ago

when we are trading in options, it is the most leveraged i.e. we are borrowing money. so the idle money has a function, and it is not idle all the time. especially on wednesdays/thursday we may be holding multiple positions so the margin requirements will go higher anyways, we aim to keep the risk lower than 15% capital in most of our systems, hence we suggest to keep 4 lacs of capital ideally. 3.5 lacs would be lowest recommended in 1x

Satheesh Kumar 4 months ago

how to know the what should be my net postions . if there is a error in execution. it should always match thepostions taken kinetic

Sanjay Pareek 4 months ago

best of the lot, have deployed since 3rd dec. I like it because, less number of trades, hedged positions, an approachable team, now I am selling options like an institution.

Dravyaniti Consulting 4 months ago

"..Now I am selling options like an institution" Makes our day and year 2020 Best wishes for 2021, to you Sanjay (Kinetic Family member) -Team Dravyaniti

Nicky Porwal 4 months ago

How can be this strategy will work on my account if I subscribe??

Dravyaniti Consulting 4 months ago

The system will auto-fire trades as per pre-defined rules

Nicky Porwal 2 months ago

Does it work with Astha or Edelweiss account and is it auto square off the position or manual as I don't have time to trade manual?

Vivek Gadodia 4 months ago

As one of the developers of Kinetic, I may be biased. This also is perhaps the best thing that has happened to me personally and my clients. It truly empowers small as well as large investors, and creates money making opportunities for everyone who understands that "Calculated Risk hai to Ishq Hai" :)

TJoe 4 months ago

One of the best strategies on Tradetron in my opinion. I have been trading it for a while now and am impressed with the whole process. Looking forward to a long term association with team Dravyaniti :)

Dravyaniti Consulting 4 months ago

Many thanks for your kind words Joe. Our mantra is customer first, and we value our association very much

PRADIP GHATE 7 months ago

to Dravyaniti Consulting Hi, some serious talk. I fed up with losses from other strategies. and also errors from their end. I lost alraedy more than 2L. now the point, I feel secured and consistant profit by KINETIC. May I invest 40L ?? Whats your openion.?? I knew, loss also possible, but KINETIC having exellant results, paper trade results also.... so atleast LOSS shall be minimul.. what is your openion,?? As you borned the startegy, you knew well. pl reply. thx

Dravyaniti Consulting 7 months ago

We have full skin in the game, as our partners monies are also invested in Kinetic. We do not expect losses to exceed 8% of capital on a 40 lac account. i.e. 3.2 lacs. However, we don't have same strategy available on tradetron yet with this multiplier. You may contact us on our helpdesk no 77100 12476 and we would be glad to see how we can help you

ASHWANI KUMAR ARORA 8 months ago

Hi, I subscribed to the strategy, the trades are showing eneterd in tradetron but not executed in my brokers account? Please examine and tell me the reason.

Dravyaniti Consulting 8 months ago

which broker do you have. can you share the logs please. also next time when such a situation happens, if you notice it during market hours, please let us know immediately so that we can resolve the issue at the earliest

ASHWANI KUMAR ARORA 8 months ago

aliceblue, also other strategies to aliceblue were executing. how to contact you in market hours promptly?

Dravyaniti Consulting 8 months ago

we have never had clients on aliceblue yet, and are glad to see you using it. With zerodha, for instance, one challenge is that the deeper OTM options are restricted - due to open interest limits Zerodha is hitting at a firm level. Zerodha is working on this is what we are given to understand. So we have requested all our Zerodha users to move temporarily atleast, since our Algo is not easy to be handled manually everyday by the client or us - to place the deeper OTM orders with manual intervention. We are not sure what the issue with Aliceblue is, and would be great to investigate. Our numbers are there in the profile page - 7710012476. My personal number is 9870104332 (Vivek) and I will help you in whatever way possible, so please do reach out Also, we feel it is unfair for us to get this rating without even getting a fair chance :(

Dravyaniti Consulting 8 months ago

if your other strategies were executing, do you suspect it could have been due to any margin issues at your end? is there a way to check why the rejections happened. please do share your number and we will get in touch with you to help you resolve this

MANIVANNAN MURUGANANDAM 9 months ago

Good one

Dravyaniti Consulting 9 months ago

Thank you Manivannan, for the kind words :) Nothing motivates more than good words

Nirav 9 months ago

I met Vivek at a workshop and I knew how trustworthy and smart he is. Faced some technical glitches (as I have no coding background) on day 1, and got pleasantly surprised how helpful Vivek was. Looking forward to be a part of Dravyaniti for a long horizon, during which I'm sure the strategy will generate my desired return. This strategy is what algo trading is all about. Systematic, POP in our favor, Risk Defined. Very Helpful team. No-Brainer for me.

Dravyaniti Consulting 9 months ago

Nirav, I did not know it's your birthday today. I just did my job. And I am so glad it has worked out well for you. The entire credit goes to my team who is tirelessly and passionately working towards us delivering on our promise- which is - follow the plan, manage the risk, keep the faith and enjoy the ride. Once again, happy birthday, mate. Have a blast !

Nirav 9 months ago

Thanks mate. Appreciate your entire team for releasing and monitoring a very trustworthy algo here :)

Umesh Ranglani 9 months ago

Monitored the strategy closely for the positions it takes in the first week. All banknifty options - 100% hedged overnight, takes extra positions intraday to generate that extra bump in returns. Very active strategy - something which just cannot be executed manually. Generated Rs.16000 on 1x in the first week for me. Time to increase it to the max 4x allowed.

Dravyaniti Consulting 9 months ago

Umesh, your commitment towards tradetron and boosting the Algo Trading ecosystem in India is totally totally inspiring. many thanks for the support by trusting us with your strategy - Team Dravyaniti

Umesh Ranglani 9 months ago

Im loving it man ... your enthusiasm, the traction you are getting and Kinetic .. i am very glad about this partnership. Thank you for your appreciation.

Dravyaniti Consulting 9 months ago

has anyone ever heard the sound of "one-hand clapping" :). it takes two to tango. the accolades go out to the technicians, the researchers, the executionists, the guys running the engine. who are never seen, never heard. kudos to them and their spirit :)

Keep Calm.Invest in Kinetic.

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Keep Calm.
Invest in Kinetic.